S3D Problems, Program, support, forum.

[chad]

Ok,

Again, Yes I can see the single registered computer in my s3d account.

I could be wrong about the spyware but I doubt it.

1) There are a number of ways to handle a profile update without the huge expense of setting up a cloud system for the software. This is a very,very expensive thing to do for a "profile update".
2) Why am I unable to use the software without logging in? After I have already registered it? And have been using it. The only change on my end is time. I hadn't fired it up in a couple of weeks.
3) It worked just fine in version 2 with the serial number after it was registered for a long time.
4) They will not allow any discussion / questions about in the forum. Smacks of being a petulant dictator.
5) They have no way to contact anyone other than through the web forms that they can just ignore.
6) In the v3 FAQ ( only shown once logged in{web}) #2 and #3 , "Is Simplify3D now hosted in the cloud? Has Simplify3D become a cloud app or cloud service?" and "Does Simplify3D require constant internet access?" They say no, my first hand experience says YES. The fact that those are #2 and 3 means that i'm not the only one concerned about the changes.
7) The terms of service are ambiguous about what info the collect and whom the sell it to.
8) If s3d isn't charging for updates then they have no recurring revenue. In case you haven't noticed the trend is for companies to sell software and then collect data on the users to supplement income. In other words you become the product. The simple fact that my legit software won't run without me logging in tells me they are forcing data gathering.
9) I have friends who have also had issues and had similar non support.

Like I said I could be wrong, but I doubt it. And the sketchy way they are avoiding the questions tells me I am right. In today's world it is logical to conclude that they are until proven otherwise.
As for the S3D bait and switch. I entered a contract with them when I bought v2 software. I gave them money, they gave me a licence to use the software. I did not agree to to participate in a "colud" product. I would have not purchased it. They changed the rules after my purchase.
You have to realize that "cloud" is a euphemism for data gathering with the intent of selling personal data. There is very little in the "cloud" that can't be done locally. The reason it isn't done is because it can't be monetized locally if you have control.

All of that aside, the simple fact is something is borked, and I can't use the software that I paid for, because for some reason I can't log into my S#$%D creator program (that doesn't need to be logged into, to work). In case you can't tell I'm pissed. I had paid work to do on my tool. Instead I spent an hour and a half diking with software.
At this point it's clear that they are a sketchy company, unfortunately they have the best slicer software out there for now. I will be reevaluating other packages. And no longer recommending it.
If you think I am wrong, go ask them exactly what data they collect from the software, good luck with that...

chad

[Bratag]

I gave them money, they gave me a licence to use the software. I did not agree to to participate in a "colud" product. I would have not purchased it. They changed the rules after my purchase.

Actually you did. Read the EULA of the product. Basically it says that they retain the right to change the software without notice etc etc pretty standard stuff.

You keep saying it wont let you use the product without logging in , but when I asked if you connected the machine to the net and tried logging in , you stated

I plugged it in again and tried to login, login isn't working.

So is it that it won't work without logging in or that you simply can't log in? If its the latter then how can you tell it won't work without logging in?

I would be interested in how you would handle a universal profile system without some sort of cloud infrastructure. At some point you need a centralized distribution node. Also cloud is only a euphemism for data gathering for people who see conspiracies around every corner. Given that my entire professional career currently deals with cloud systems I know a little of what I am talking about right now. The cloud simply refers to a decentralized server/storage system and the associated API to interact with that system. No more no less.

As for the spyware , you are making a fairly serious accusation there and its with little or no more proof than "It seems sketchy". If you are worried - do what I did - stick a packet sniffer on your network and watch traffic for a while, hell better yet - have your firewall block all traffic from S3D (after you get the registration issue sorted of course)

[Pekish79]

you need the connection only the first time i had 3 computer and s3d has only 2 license i had it on 2 pc and then i decided to use my laptops instead i had to be online to deactivate one of the 2 copy from one pc
then i had to be online to activate the copy i just deactivated on 1 pc and activate it on my laptop

once i did that i can use it offline no problem i think u are making it harder then what it is because perhaps there is some problem with ur account

[chad]

You are right, I may need to loosen my tin foil hat. But that doesn't explain why I have to login into a program that says I don't have to log in to use. The only conclusion that I can come up with is they are forcing it to collect data.
I needed to get work done today. When I tried to run the program it demanded that I login to use it. I tried my credentials that were sufficient to log me into the website and my program still wouldn't run. s3d actually contacted me and told me to change my password. I did and now it's running. *note I changed nothing on my end. It just decided that I needed to login but It didn't work with or without an internet connection. This is not the first time that I have these issues. I have also heard it from my other friends.

I understand the EULA means they can do whatever they want, doesn't make any less crappy.
As for the cloud stuff. A universal profile system is a lame excuse for the resources needed to implement it. You can only have two licensed copys of the software installed. An xml file emailed or or a usb stick would take care of that with far less expense.

While the debate was fun, s3d has wasted enough of my time today. I'll still be looking at other programs. I'd like to note: this conversation wouldn't be allowed over there. Thankfully rick allows free expression. I'll ask the support guy what data the program collects. I'll let you know if they respond, and I'll fire up wire shark

chad

[wmgeorge]

I want to add my two cents worth here. Simplify 3D is going to a lot of trouble to protect the use of a $150 program. Its a pain to have an internet connection and mess with the two computer limit. Especially when there are a lot of "free" software out there.

[chad]

So did a little packet sniffing of S3D creator:

On launch of the program it talks a LOT to 162.249.4.246 - A2-Hosting It also talks to 104.67.70.15 Something on Akami, not sure why.
When you 'prepare to print' it opens a ssl port 443 connection to 192.241.178.140 at http://www.digitalocean.com a cloud hosting firm. It seems to only do this if you are logged in. This might be to retrieve the profile?
Everything it talks is encrypted so there is no way to tell.
When you login through the program it talks to 162.249.4.246 and also 192.241.178.140 again.

It is definitely a chatty Cathy. Make of it what you will. I just wish there was a shred of transparency from their end what it is really doing.
I asked the support guy what it is gathering, I'll let you know if I get a response. I'm not holding my breath.

chad

[Bratag]

I want to add my two cents worth here. Simplify 3D is going to a lot of trouble to protect the use of a $150 program. Its a pain to have an internet connection and mess with the two computer limit. Especially when there are a lot of "free" software out there.

As a software guy myself I don't actually consider it a lot of trouble that they are going to. Heck my IDEA Intellij just went to a similar model. What they are protecting is not the software but their time investment. Yes there are a lot of free slicers out there and nobody is saying don't use them. If S3D provides you with something you consider worth 150 bucks then you gotta pay the price and abide by their EULA, thems the breaks with any software. Hopefully what you get for that is a premium product and support (though Chad appears not to have gotten his 150 bucks worth)

As for the chatter , I didn't run a print while I was sniffing so it is interesting that they talk to the cloud on print. Its possible they are simply saving the current profile/model to your cloud storage so that you can get it back from another machine, not quite sure how I feel about that as I guess its possible they could simply scrape all the STL. I'd have to do a deeper dive on the number of packets etc to see how much data we are talking about.

Some more transparency on the part of S3D might very well be needed. I will say the 192 addy is most likely an internal proxy or gateway 192 addys are reserved for private use.

[wmgeorge]

Or they could do it the way Autodesk does it, when I registered my still new in a box AutoCAD LT 2008. For each install you just use the CD ID number / code and they send back a verification that you use to validate the install. No internet required after that procedure. In fact if you don't have internet access you can do it by phone.

And BTW I pay for all my software even the downloaded trial versions, IF they work and I use.

[chad]

192.168.*.* is internal. But https://who.is/whois-ip/ip-address/192.241.178.140 is the cloud service digitalocean.
I got a response to my direct question " What is the software collecting on my machine":

Hi Chad,

The software periodically checks to see if updates are available. If you would like to disable the automated checks for updates you should be able to do so from the tools > options menu.

Ah, Yea. I have this turned off.

chad